Dhundhun
10-24 01:55 PM
Rates vary for 4 months, 6 months and 1 year return tickets. Decide as per your convenience.
Why someone would give red dot for this?
I think, site is being attacked by terrorists, want to annoy everyone. Admins, find out guys and take appropriate actions.
Why someone would give red dot for this?
I think, site is being attacked by terrorists, want to annoy everyone. Admins, find out guys and take appropriate actions.
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spgtopper
05-09 04:08 PM
Hi dudu,
If you attend the local event on May 15th, you will be able to get a ton of local contacts that will be very useful in forming a group etc.
We are hoping that at the May 15th event, several local (DC metro area) IV members will meet and get to know each other as well - that should be a good start to form a strong local group.
S.
If you attend the local event on May 15th, you will be able to get a ton of local contacts that will be very useful in forming a group etc.
We are hoping that at the May 15th event, several local (DC metro area) IV members will meet and get to know each other as well - that should be a good start to form a strong local group.
S.
Desi_Hydrabadi
02-20 03:35 PM
All,
My PERM labor was filed in Dec 2006. I didn't know much about all the technicalities in that process. I found today, from the flcdatacenter website, my labor petition number and was shocked to see the wage mentioned in there is "50.34", "Hr". I assume thats the pay I would get if I get the GC. My current pay is 60K/year. I have approved I-140 and have also applied my I-485 in the July 2007 fiasco.
I am now heart broken since I am not sure if I would ever get the GC cause the wage mentioned in LC and what I am getting right now has huge difference.
What can I do at this point of time? Any suggestion would be helpful to me.
Thank you.
My PERM labor was filed in Dec 2006. I didn't know much about all the technicalities in that process. I found today, from the flcdatacenter website, my labor petition number and was shocked to see the wage mentioned in there is "50.34", "Hr". I assume thats the pay I would get if I get the GC. My current pay is 60K/year. I have approved I-140 and have also applied my I-485 in the July 2007 fiasco.
I am now heart broken since I am not sure if I would ever get the GC cause the wage mentioned in LC and what I am getting right now has huge difference.
What can I do at this point of time? Any suggestion would be helpful to me.
Thank you.
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Almond
08-14 12:10 PM
^^^^ sounds like good news, I'm happy for you:)
more...
days_go_by
05-25 10:57 PM
and everyone else involved.
hary536
05-18 07:41 PM
Hi,
My Company has decided to have a force shutdown one day per week starting from this month. So now we will be working 4 days instead of 5 days. We also cannot use PTO during these days. So effectively will be working 32 hrs instead of 40 hrs and getting paid for 32 hrs only.
Does this affect my legal H1 status? Will i still remain in valid legal H1 status, even if i work and get paid for 32 hrs?
Am i still considered full-time? Or is there any amendment needed to be filed? How can i determine, if there is any amendment needed to be filed? If needed, does the company have to file both H1B and LCA amendment or just LCA.
When one files amendment, is it like again the entire process of H1 approval and can the amendment be rejected?
Also if they file LCA amendment, then do they have to show and pay the salary according to current year? or the year when they initially filed my LCA first time?
If i try for H1B transfer after few months,can that be denied due to paychecks of 32hrs salary only used for H1 transfer?
Pls help, if you have any idea about this kind of situation. Lot of companies are having shutdowns and salary cuts this year? How is it handled in your companies guys?
Currently, I am working on H1B since Oct'08.
My company has decided to have forced shutdown 1 day per week. So All employees will be working and paid for only 32 hrs instead of 40.We cannot use the paid leave also.
In My LCA, prevailing wage: 52K, and my salary in LCA and I-129: 64.5K
My questions:
1) Is working 32 hrs still considered full-time and do I still remain in legal H1 status? (I heard that in US more than 30 hrs is considered full-time?)
2) Since my effective annual salary will be less than 64K due to working for only 32 hrs,will i be out of status? Can the company cut my salary below the rate of pay mentioned on my LCA but higher than(or equal to) the Prevailing Wage mentioned on my LCA?
3) If i try for H1B transfer after few months using paychecks of 32hrs salary only,can that be denied?
4) Are there any other options(without filing any H1B/LCA amendment) to maintain my H1 status while still working for 32 hrs only?
5) IF company files LCA/H1B amendment, then do they have to again use the wage survey for 2009 or they can use the same one used for my initial 1st LCA filing? Do they evaluate the entire H1B application again for amendment? Can the H1B amendment be denied?
Anyone pls advise? I am really tensed.
My Company has decided to have a force shutdown one day per week starting from this month. So now we will be working 4 days instead of 5 days. We also cannot use PTO during these days. So effectively will be working 32 hrs instead of 40 hrs and getting paid for 32 hrs only.
Does this affect my legal H1 status? Will i still remain in valid legal H1 status, even if i work and get paid for 32 hrs?
Am i still considered full-time? Or is there any amendment needed to be filed? How can i determine, if there is any amendment needed to be filed? If needed, does the company have to file both H1B and LCA amendment or just LCA.
When one files amendment, is it like again the entire process of H1 approval and can the amendment be rejected?
Also if they file LCA amendment, then do they have to show and pay the salary according to current year? or the year when they initially filed my LCA first time?
If i try for H1B transfer after few months,can that be denied due to paychecks of 32hrs salary only used for H1 transfer?
Pls help, if you have any idea about this kind of situation. Lot of companies are having shutdowns and salary cuts this year? How is it handled in your companies guys?
Currently, I am working on H1B since Oct'08.
My company has decided to have forced shutdown 1 day per week. So All employees will be working and paid for only 32 hrs instead of 40.We cannot use the paid leave also.
In My LCA, prevailing wage: 52K, and my salary in LCA and I-129: 64.5K
My questions:
1) Is working 32 hrs still considered full-time and do I still remain in legal H1 status? (I heard that in US more than 30 hrs is considered full-time?)
2) Since my effective annual salary will be less than 64K due to working for only 32 hrs,will i be out of status? Can the company cut my salary below the rate of pay mentioned on my LCA but higher than(or equal to) the Prevailing Wage mentioned on my LCA?
3) If i try for H1B transfer after few months using paychecks of 32hrs salary only,can that be denied?
4) Are there any other options(without filing any H1B/LCA amendment) to maintain my H1 status while still working for 32 hrs only?
5) IF company files LCA/H1B amendment, then do they have to again use the wage survey for 2009 or they can use the same one used for my initial 1st LCA filing? Do they evaluate the entire H1B application again for amendment? Can the H1B amendment be denied?
Anyone pls advise? I am really tensed.
more...
GCNaseeb
11-15 08:52 AM
When we went for our Biometrics, all our FP Notices were misspelled. We informed the bio technician and she corrected on their system there itself.
After the FP, I see there is an LUD also. I am hoping today's infopass meeting would be fruitful. Let's hope they just certifiy my EAD and AP there itself. :)
My name was misspelt on my FP notice as well.when i went for FP couple of weeks back, they could not make the change there.I told them about the name misspelt, they informed that I have to call the 1-800 number and get it changed.
After the FP, I see there is an LUD also. I am hoping today's infopass meeting would be fruitful. Let's hope they just certifiy my EAD and AP there itself. :)
My name was misspelt on my FP notice as well.when i went for FP couple of weeks back, they could not make the change there.I told them about the name misspelt, they informed that I have to call the 1-800 number and get it changed.
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atulnayak1
02-19 12:03 PM
Franks Red Hot sauce, I put that sh&t on EVERYTHING!
more...
steppenwolf
09-26 04:57 PM
that's interesting...
i got my checks cashed on 9/21 but no receipt yet. i sent my application on 8/8 to NSC.
online status says a notice has been mailed out - any clue how long this takes after the check has been cashed?
i got my checks cashed on 9/21 but no receipt yet. i sent my application on 8/8 to NSC.
online status says a notice has been mailed out - any clue how long this takes after the check has been cashed?
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immi2006
05-24 10:17 AM
Does not matter how many points, can u be one of the 6300 ?
The points are not defined well, so do not speculate, it is not abt getting into Wharton / or yale, it takes years to implement a working system, look at Perm, they started in 2001, it took 4 years to implement.
The points are not defined well, so do not speculate, it is not abt getting into Wharton / or yale, it takes years to implement a working system, look at Perm, they started in 2001, it took 4 years to implement.
more...
BPforGC
05-11 01:51 PM
This guy has no clue on anything...
He says he gets back after talking to the 'subject experts'....
A senator clearly asked him what to do on backlogs. If he has an iota of knowledge and real interest in immigration, he should have told to increase visa numbers, eliminate country limit and recapture legislation. All he said was he will get back to them and this opportunity has gone into thin air....
So, this statement clearly epitomizes why USCIS is an inefficient and hopeless agency. They talk too much, think less and do nothing.
Don't count on USCIS to do something to eliminate backlog. They are idiots and inefficient morons.
Out of 10+ members of Judiciary committee, only two to three really care about an agency that is trying to work on legal immigration and present for this hearing. Talk about illegal immigration, every one will start running out of their beds with their pants down to get attention... this is really disconcerting.
The whole hearing is a time waste for everyone. It did not achieve anything except patting each others back. Disgusting...
He says he gets back after talking to the 'subject experts'....
A senator clearly asked him what to do on backlogs. If he has an iota of knowledge and real interest in immigration, he should have told to increase visa numbers, eliminate country limit and recapture legislation. All he said was he will get back to them and this opportunity has gone into thin air....
So, this statement clearly epitomizes why USCIS is an inefficient and hopeless agency. They talk too much, think less and do nothing.
Don't count on USCIS to do something to eliminate backlog. They are idiots and inefficient morons.
Out of 10+ members of Judiciary committee, only two to three really care about an agency that is trying to work on legal immigration and present for this hearing. Talk about illegal immigration, every one will start running out of their beds with their pants down to get attention... this is really disconcerting.
The whole hearing is a time waste for everyone. It did not achieve anything except patting each others back. Disgusting...
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andymajumder
09-22 09:33 PM
I applied in early August too but haven't received mine yet. I had delayed applying for my AP and current one expired last week, in the meantime it is possible that I may have to visit India since my dad has suddenly been hospitalized. Is there a way to get an Emergency AP?
Many thanks
Many thanks
more...
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gcdreamer05
01-15 06:14 PM
can we just buy a vacation for the burger king (a.ka. steve king) and ask him to go to bahamas or cancun or somewhere.... so that we can pass the recapture bill....
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immi2006
05-04 10:41 AM
THose are labour filed.
It is difficult to pull the 140 stats for the same labour. But I did a rough data extract from immigration.com based on what folks have mentioned, it seems like 140 is taking 8 months average presently, RFEs are in 40 % of cases, and also approved 140 seems to be like around 2000 in total for EB2, and EB3 categories for 2005 filings.. which means large numbers are still pending in Texas or Folks have not updated their data.
One thing that emerges clear from the data pattern :
Presently EB2 turn around time for Perm is approx 26 days, EB3 is 41 days average.
140 for EB2 from a MNC = 6 months, 140 for EB2 from a small company 8 months avg.
Hi Immi2006.
Please help me understanding this..
Your statistics underneath::; 1) Is it NO. of Labour Petitions filed in those years and categories or 2) Are they Numbers of Labor and 140 approved pending cases for 485?:confused:
Please enlighten me....
thanks:)
It is difficult to pull the 140 stats for the same labour. But I did a rough data extract from immigration.com based on what folks have mentioned, it seems like 140 is taking 8 months average presently, RFEs are in 40 % of cases, and also approved 140 seems to be like around 2000 in total for EB2, and EB3 categories for 2005 filings.. which means large numbers are still pending in Texas or Folks have not updated their data.
One thing that emerges clear from the data pattern :
Presently EB2 turn around time for Perm is approx 26 days, EB3 is 41 days average.
140 for EB2 from a MNC = 6 months, 140 for EB2 from a small company 8 months avg.
Hi Immi2006.
Please help me understanding this..
Your statistics underneath::; 1) Is it NO. of Labour Petitions filed in those years and categories or 2) Are they Numbers of Labor and 140 approved pending cases for 485?:confused:
Please enlighten me....
thanks:)
more...
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Munna Bhai
02-08 11:32 AM
Hello,
My thread had wrong title and that created more problem, hope this title makes sense and please feel free to share your experience.
I know the following, I worked very hard for the current company and they pay me the way they pay any immigrant. Atlast got my I-140 approved and now I would like to go ahead with available options and at any cost I will protect I-140 from being revoked.
If I-140 is not revoked:
a)One can extend H1b through any company for 3-years.
b)One can get PD ported.
If I-140 is revoked:
a)It is a grey area but commen-sense says that one is out-of-status.
How to protect I-140 being revoked:
a)Transfer the case to your own attorney?? See that employer or employer's attorney has not much say on your case file??
b)Give some valid reason to current employer until your I-140 from other company is approved.
Or any other thoughts???
My thread had wrong title and that created more problem, hope this title makes sense and please feel free to share your experience.
I know the following, I worked very hard for the current company and they pay me the way they pay any immigrant. Atlast got my I-140 approved and now I would like to go ahead with available options and at any cost I will protect I-140 from being revoked.
If I-140 is not revoked:
a)One can extend H1b through any company for 3-years.
b)One can get PD ported.
If I-140 is revoked:
a)It is a grey area but commen-sense says that one is out-of-status.
How to protect I-140 being revoked:
a)Transfer the case to your own attorney?? See that employer or employer's attorney has not much say on your case file??
b)Give some valid reason to current employer until your I-140 from other company is approved.
Or any other thoughts???
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ski_dude12
09-26 06:50 PM
You can do the following to get your case to be picked up-
1. Open an service request that your case is beyond normal processing times. However it is very likely that since the visa numbers are over for 2010 you might get a response that no visa numbers available and you will have to wait 30 days before you can open SR again.
2. Contact local congressman
3. Send email to SCOPSSCATA@dhs.gov giving your case details.
Mention in all steps above that there is no update to your case even when 2006 cases are getting approved.
Hope that helps. Do what you can to ensure that your file is picked up.
This is disheartening...
1. Open an service request that your case is beyond normal processing times. However it is very likely that since the visa numbers are over for 2010 you might get a response that no visa numbers available and you will have to wait 30 days before you can open SR again.
2. Contact local congressman
3. Send email to SCOPSSCATA@dhs.gov giving your case details.
Mention in all steps above that there is no update to your case even when 2006 cases are getting approved.
Hope that helps. Do what you can to ensure that your file is picked up.
This is disheartening...
more...
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sac-r-ten
03-12 09:40 PM
I did not get a second finger printing notice (yet?). The 485 approval notice said that a biometric appt may be sent or the card will arrive. Just keeping my fingers crossed.
My first FP was done in Dec 2007
Congrats. Hope 2 get ur email and cards soon.
My first FP was done in Nov 2007. Its already 15mths and i was wondering they will ask for 2nd one now. But seeing your case, i think my case is normal. i have also read some other threads where ppl have not received 2nd FP even after 15mths.
My first FP was done in Dec 2007
Congrats. Hope 2 get ur email and cards soon.
My first FP was done in Nov 2007. Its already 15mths and i was wondering they will ask for 2nd one now. But seeing your case, i think my case is normal. i have also read some other threads where ppl have not received 2nd FP even after 15mths.
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wellwisher02
03-27 03:39 PM
why will it retrogate again? we will see forward movement. be +ve and optimistic.:)
Agreed! Let's think positive that it will move forward.
Agreed! Let's think positive that it will move forward.
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krishmunn
04-07 02:18 PM
The problem is most of the visas are taken by indian bodyshops such as infosys, TCS, LT to bring underskilled computer operators to the US. Intel, MS and other good companies that hire from reputed US universities have hard time getting the visas due to the cap. The cap should work the other way round. 20K for bodyshops and 65K for people from US universities.
You mean those passing from the likes of TVU and ITU or those from Harvard/MIT ?? How do you define "reputed" US University ? And why do you think clients engage "underskilled" operators and not "skilled" US graduates ? Lower rate ? But then we see so many US graduates languishing in EB 3 ???
BTW, why are you still having a hard time getting visa --- the quota was wide open till January at least .
There is no point blaming on non-US students when US students are making a beeline to desi consultants for H1. May be the law should be -- no consulting job for US graduates.
You mean those passing from the likes of TVU and ITU or those from Harvard/MIT ?? How do you define "reputed" US University ? And why do you think clients engage "underskilled" operators and not "skilled" US graduates ? Lower rate ? But then we see so many US graduates languishing in EB 3 ???
BTW, why are you still having a hard time getting visa --- the quota was wide open till January at least .
There is no point blaming on non-US students when US students are making a beeline to desi consultants for H1. May be the law should be -- no consulting job for US graduates.
aadimanav
06-22 12:25 AM
Source:
The Oh Law Firm (http://www.immigration-law.com/)
06/21/2009: CIR and What's Ahead
On Friday, Obama Press Secretary Robert Gibbs officially announced that the President was scheduled to call a small group of Congressional leaders and political leaders to the White House to open a dialogue on CIR next Thursday, 06/25/2009. Troublesome was another statement that recognizes the facts by the Press Secretary at the same press conference that the Congress did not have enough numbers to pass a CIR legislation. As we reported earlier, for a CIR to pass the Congress, it should pass both the Senate and the House. However, it is the House that lacks enough numbers at this time to pass a CIR legislation this year. There are a plenty of House legislators who represent districts that are politically not affected by the Hispanic population and their political pressures. These legislators usually form a group of Democratic represenstives who are either conservative and middle of the road in the political ideology. The situation tends to be different when it comes to the Senate that is consisted of legislators based on their statewide consistuencies as opposed to the House representatives that represent small neighborhood and district constituencies. The Senators' decisions are thus derived more from broader national political or statewide political issues and interests of the whole party. For this reasons, for the past several years, the Senate initiated and was able to pass CIR bills which have ended up in the ditch when it moved to the House floor. The background behind the Press Secretary's announcement downplaying the potential success of CIR within this year is their motivation to control unrealistic rise of expectation in the CIR supporting community on the President's initiatives that can also end up in another ditch with potential negative political fall-outs to his political leadership. The current politcal landscape and environment then raise two questions. The first question is whether the President and the Democratic Congress will have enough energy and zeal to successfuly change the existing political landscape, particularly in the House of Representatives, within such a limited time within this year. The Congress will soon go into the Summer recess and the remaining legislative days in the Congressional calendar for 2009 are very limited. The second question is why then Senate Majority leader, Sen. Harry Reid, has been spinning in media on his agenda to take up a CIR bill this fall with the full realization of political reality that can be ditched again in the House. It appears that part of such spinning is related to his own political future. His seat in the Senate will be up for reelection in the national mid-term election in 2010 and he needs a strong support from the Hispanic constituency in the State of Nevada. The Hispanic population has been rapidly growing durng the past several years in the State of Nevada. His push for a CIR will achieve his political calculation, no matter whether the bill will pass or fail in the Senate. Again, the chance for a CIR passing the Senate in 2009 is indeed very good as the chance for Senate Democrats pulling together 60 votes may turn realistic, particularly as affected by the final result of the current Senate election dispute in the State of Minnesota. In the very near future, the Minnesota Supreme Court is likely to hand down a decision sustaining the election of Mr. Al Franken, a progressive Democrat, as the next Senator, over the conservative former(?) Senator Norm Coleman. For the discussion per se, let's assume that the CIR fails to pass either in the Senate or in the House. The Senator Harry Reid will still get all the credits in his Hispanic constituency in the State of Nevada for his initiatives in the Senate to legislate a CIR!
All in all, year 2009 will turn out to be the only year that can pass a CIR because this is a so-called leap-year when there is no national reelection and the House members will be less affected by their activities this year. The key is whether the President Obama will have enough energy, steam, and polical motive to make a full-court pressing and arm-twisting of the conservative Democratic members in the House within a "very" short period of time, within this Summer or early fall at the latest. Currently, his and Democrats' top two reform agenda stay with the nation's health care and energy reforms. Until we see such full dedication and commitment of the President to the CIR within a given time, one should not raise the level of his/her hope or expectation too high as it will indeed bring out really devastating frustration and hopelessness in 2010 in that considering the November 2010 mid-year election, the chance for CIR next year will turn out to be very slim because of the rerunnng Democrats in the election from small districts that are not affected by the Hispanic political pressures. Until we see such solid momentum and heat of passion on the part of the President leading to quick actions in the near future, all the media campaign and spinning of news by the White House and the Senator Reid may have to be taken with caution and discount.
The Oh Law Firm (http://www.immigration-law.com/)
06/21/2009: CIR and What's Ahead
On Friday, Obama Press Secretary Robert Gibbs officially announced that the President was scheduled to call a small group of Congressional leaders and political leaders to the White House to open a dialogue on CIR next Thursday, 06/25/2009. Troublesome was another statement that recognizes the facts by the Press Secretary at the same press conference that the Congress did not have enough numbers to pass a CIR legislation. As we reported earlier, for a CIR to pass the Congress, it should pass both the Senate and the House. However, it is the House that lacks enough numbers at this time to pass a CIR legislation this year. There are a plenty of House legislators who represent districts that are politically not affected by the Hispanic population and their political pressures. These legislators usually form a group of Democratic represenstives who are either conservative and middle of the road in the political ideology. The situation tends to be different when it comes to the Senate that is consisted of legislators based on their statewide consistuencies as opposed to the House representatives that represent small neighborhood and district constituencies. The Senators' decisions are thus derived more from broader national political or statewide political issues and interests of the whole party. For this reasons, for the past several years, the Senate initiated and was able to pass CIR bills which have ended up in the ditch when it moved to the House floor. The background behind the Press Secretary's announcement downplaying the potential success of CIR within this year is their motivation to control unrealistic rise of expectation in the CIR supporting community on the President's initiatives that can also end up in another ditch with potential negative political fall-outs to his political leadership. The current politcal landscape and environment then raise two questions. The first question is whether the President and the Democratic Congress will have enough energy and zeal to successfuly change the existing political landscape, particularly in the House of Representatives, within such a limited time within this year. The Congress will soon go into the Summer recess and the remaining legislative days in the Congressional calendar for 2009 are very limited. The second question is why then Senate Majority leader, Sen. Harry Reid, has been spinning in media on his agenda to take up a CIR bill this fall with the full realization of political reality that can be ditched again in the House. It appears that part of such spinning is related to his own political future. His seat in the Senate will be up for reelection in the national mid-term election in 2010 and he needs a strong support from the Hispanic constituency in the State of Nevada. The Hispanic population has been rapidly growing durng the past several years in the State of Nevada. His push for a CIR will achieve his political calculation, no matter whether the bill will pass or fail in the Senate. Again, the chance for a CIR passing the Senate in 2009 is indeed very good as the chance for Senate Democrats pulling together 60 votes may turn realistic, particularly as affected by the final result of the current Senate election dispute in the State of Minnesota. In the very near future, the Minnesota Supreme Court is likely to hand down a decision sustaining the election of Mr. Al Franken, a progressive Democrat, as the next Senator, over the conservative former(?) Senator Norm Coleman. For the discussion per se, let's assume that the CIR fails to pass either in the Senate or in the House. The Senator Harry Reid will still get all the credits in his Hispanic constituency in the State of Nevada for his initiatives in the Senate to legislate a CIR!
All in all, year 2009 will turn out to be the only year that can pass a CIR because this is a so-called leap-year when there is no national reelection and the House members will be less affected by their activities this year. The key is whether the President Obama will have enough energy, steam, and polical motive to make a full-court pressing and arm-twisting of the conservative Democratic members in the House within a "very" short period of time, within this Summer or early fall at the latest. Currently, his and Democrats' top two reform agenda stay with the nation's health care and energy reforms. Until we see such full dedication and commitment of the President to the CIR within a given time, one should not raise the level of his/her hope or expectation too high as it will indeed bring out really devastating frustration and hopelessness in 2010 in that considering the November 2010 mid-year election, the chance for CIR next year will turn out to be very slim because of the rerunnng Democrats in the election from small districts that are not affected by the Hispanic political pressures. Until we see such solid momentum and heat of passion on the part of the President leading to quick actions in the near future, all the media campaign and spinning of news by the White House and the Senator Reid may have to be taken with caution and discount.
EB-VoiceImmigration
09-07 03:17 PM
How about even a much better solution, learn your country's national language......:)
My Initial reaction to this post and others(including the one who said he is from AP .. but I believe in reality he is not..) who think every one in india should learn hindi.
--> FCUK U. Who the hell are you to say this ?
Now.. lets dicuss...
It is not even a requirement in India to learn hindi. Why in the world it is required to access a forum based on US EB immigration?
Dont get zealous of raise of south in IT and lets not make a debate on what people are doing in our part of the world. It will never end.
My Initial reaction to this post and others(including the one who said he is from AP .. but I believe in reality he is not..) who think every one in india should learn hindi.
--> FCUK U. Who the hell are you to say this ?
Now.. lets dicuss...
It is not even a requirement in India to learn hindi. Why in the world it is required to access a forum based on US EB immigration?
Dont get zealous of raise of south in IT and lets not make a debate on what people are doing in our part of the world. It will never end.